Mount Everest is one of the most iconic mountains in the world—a symbol of challenge, adventure, and, sometimes, controversy. In this episode, I sat down with Will Cockrell, author of his new book, Everst Inc., which unpacks the rich and often misunderstood history of guiding on Everest. Through our conversation, Will offered insights into the guiding industry, the Sherpa community, and why Everest remains such a captivating place for climbers and adventurers alike. 

Key Takeaways

• Everest Guiding Evolution: The guiding industry on Everest has come a long way since the 1990s, with Sherpa climbers now taking leading roles.

• Modern Challenges: Guiding on Everest involves managing commercialization, safety, and the expectations of climbers.

• Simone Moro’s Insight: True adventure still exists on Everest for those willing to seek out new routes and challenges.

• Sherpa Contributions: Sherpas are highly trained professionals, not just porters, and are now reaping the rewards of the guiding industry.

• The Deadliest Season: The 2023 season was the deadliest in Everest history, highlighting the need for continued improvements in safety and decision-making.

• Media Misconceptions: Headlines about Everest often miss the complexity of what’s happening on the ground.

• Balancing Act: The challenge for the future is balancing accessibility with preserving the majesty and safety of the mountain.

A Guiding Dream and a Writing Path

Will began by sharing his journey from aspiring mountaineering guide to becoming an adventure writer. In his early twenties, Will lived out of his truck, apprenticing for guiding companies and even working for the National Outdoor Leadership School (NOLS). Though he loved the guiding life, the reality of the sacrifices it required led him to pursue writing—a path that allowed him to combine his passion for adventure with storytelling. “I wanted to marry the two,” Will explained. “Writing about adventure became my way to stay close to the mountains while finding my own niche.”

Relating to the Amateur Adventurer

Despite his deep involvement in the outdoors, Will never considered himself a professional guide. Instead, he always related more to the client side of things—the learner, the amateur—someone still striving to master the skills needed to navigate the mountains. This unique perspective gave Will an empathetic approach in his writing. “I have more in common with an Everest client than an Everest guide,” Will said, emphasizing that he writes for those of us who still have much to learn.

The Draw of the Mountain

When discussing the allure of mountaineering, Will mentioned that the appeal goes beyond the summit. He described it as “a weird draw to suffering,” a coupling of challenge and reward that doesn’t make sense to everyone. He compared it to splitboarding—the process of hiking uphill for hours just to spend a few minutes riding downhill. “It’s hard to convince people that’s fun,” Will joked, “but there’s something about the process, about earning it, that makes it worth it.”

Debunking Everest Myths

Much of Will’s book focuses on debunking popular myths about Mount Everest. One of the most persistent misconceptions is that Everest has become a “mess”—overcrowded, chaotic, and devoid of the majesty it once held. Will pointed to the infamous 2019 “conga line” photo, showing climbers waiting in line near the summit, as a prime example of how media narratives can be misleading. “There’s a lot more to that story,” Will explained. The photo may have captured a chaotic moment, but it doesn’t tell the whole tale. Many guides and climbers experienced solitude on the summit that same year, enjoying moments of serenity away from the crowds.

Modern Guiding Challenges on Mount Everest

The guiding industry on Everest faces numerous challenges today. Managing large groups, ensuring climbers' safety, and dealing with the pressures of commercialization are constant hurdles. Will highlighted how the industry is still figuring out how to balance these elements while preserving the spirit of adventure that draws people to the mountain. “It’s not just about getting people to the top—it’s about doing it responsibly,” Will emphasized.

Simone Moro’s Perspective on Everest Adventure

One of the standout stories from our conversation was that of Simone Moro, a professional climber who has both climbed Everest and flown helicopters in the Himalayas. Simone, who is not involved in guiding clients but is deeply embedded in the Everest region, offered a unique perspective on the mountain's evolution. He described how there are still bold routes and challenges left for those willing to push themselves, even though Everest might seem overly commercialized to some. “There’s a ton of stuff that hasn’t been done,” Simone said, reminding us that true adventure is still out there for those who seek it.

The Deadliest Climbing Season on Everest

We also discussed the 2023 climbing season, which tragically became the deadliest in Everest’s history. Will explained that this spike in fatalities was partly due to some inexperienced Nepali companies making questionable decisions. However, he expressed hope that these incidents would lead to important changes, as the guiding community in Nepal is constantly learning and improving. “There’s always a discussion happening—how can we make it safer?” Will noted, emphasizing that growth often comes with growing pains.

The Evolving Sherpa Perspective on Mount Everest

A significant part of our conversation focused on the Sherpa community, whose role in the Everest industry has evolved considerably. Will shared that while the early guiding years saw Sherpas in largely uncelebrated roles, today many Sherpa climbers are certified guides, owning and running the majority of guiding operations on the mountain. “It took a while for full equity,” Will said, “but now the people reaping the most reward from the Everest business are the Nepalese themselves.” He emphasized that the Sherpa guides are not just porters—they are highly skilled professionals whose work is crucial to the success of any expedition. Training programs, such as the IFMGA certification, have helped many Sherpas gain the skills needed to become fully recognized mountain guides, further solidifying their vital role in the industry.

Balancing Accessibility and Preservation on Everest

One of the most thought-provoking parts of our conversation revolved around the tension between making Everest accessible and preserving its majesty. Will addressed the criticism around the commercialization of Everest and the images of tent cities and littered camps. He acknowledged that Camp Four, the highest camp before the summit, can indeed be a “dystopian hellscape,” but emphasized that the conversation on how to manage the mountain is ongoing among the Nepali companies that now run the operations. “It’s their mountain, and they’re trying to figure it out,” Will said, suggesting that the path to improvement is still in progress.

The Personal Experience of Climbing Mount Everest

Throughout our talk, it became clear that the Everest experience is deeply personal. Whether you’re a seasoned mountaineer or a first-time climber, Everest represents something different for everyone. Will emphasized that the motivations for climbing—whether for personal growth, spiritual connection, or simply the challenge—are as diverse as the people attempting the climb. “At the end of the day, it’s all individualized,” he said. “The question is: did you get what you were looking for?”

The Future of Mount Everest Guiding

Looking ahead, Will doesn’t claim to have all the answers about the future of Everest, but he remains optimistic. “The conversation is always happening,” he said. The industry is young, still growing, and figuring out how to balance safety, accessibility, and reverence for the mountain. For Will, as long as the discussion continues, there’s hope for Everest to remain both a place of challenge and of inspiration for generations to come.

Emory, By Land

Thanks for stopping by! If you have any questions for me or want to connect, you can leave a comment below or shoot me a personal message at emory@byland.co.

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